It's frustrating to me that Amy and Devin can talk endlessly about films' gender politics, which sometimes are so subtle I'm not sure they're actually there, but when it comes to species politics they are beyond oblivious. Amy's comments on bullfighting bordered on sociopathic IMO.
OP would've fucking hated Ernest Hemingway or Budd Boetticher.
It is a little odd that in a 60 minute discussion about the nuclear obliteration of humanity, you got upset about a host one time seeing a bullfight.
Also, if it's made by a human, ideas of gender are in the text/film/art. You may just not be looking for it. (Race and class too for that matter.)
Fuck all that. It was a very interesting insight into the used imagery in the film,. One of the best comments I think I've heard Amy give on the show. Maybe that doesn't sound like a compliment, but it's intended as one.
I'm a vegetarian, so, let me weight in on this: It's to each his own, man. If somebody is able to watch an animal die, he or she might as well be "allowed" to eat meat. I couldn't. That's why I don't eat animals. But who am I to judge? I have the unbelievable luxury to be able to choose what I want to eat. Most people in this world can't afford that. Also, there happens to be a lot of great vegetarian food aviable in the country where I live. And besides that, it's something everybody as to make up his own mind about.
And I do get what Amy said about that bull fight. Death is such a mundane thing. If we watch a lot of movies, we tend to forget this.
Also, Amy, if you want to eat less meat and don't want to rely on frikin Tofu (I hate that stuff... ), I URGE you to check out Palestinian dishes. It's the best... one word: Humus!
Best thread ever.
That was probably my favorite part of the episode.
It's a podcast where you don't seem to like either host. You might want to stop listening and try to meet some members of your own species.
What's funny is I thought about mentioning that day's epilogue: Driving home, my conscience felt dirty. I was mad at the matadors, yet I'd spent the whole day eating carne asada.
I'm a carnivore. But before I made it back to LA, I ordered Mark Bittman's book on vegetarian cooking and resolved to eat fewer meat-based meals every day. Still do. That was years ago, but that one afternoon haunts me. The bullfight did its job: I'm more aware of death.
Guess I should have kept dominating the show with my dietary history so I didn't get called a sociopath, but I figured it was time to get back to talking movies.
Devin, you dult, who said it was one or the other? But since you frame it that way, yes, I do think species politics is way more important than gender, class or racial politics. Seventy billion farm animals are slaughtered every year. To put that in perspective, scientists estimate only about 130 billion humans have existed in our entire history. Animal suffering is infinitely worse than human suffering. But keep on with your speciesist demagoguery. I'm sure you'll find a lot of idiots here who will lap it up.
"Assumably, tradition and ritual aren't acceptable justifications to Amy for sexist practices." Dude, don't pull troubling assumptions like that out of your ass to justify your already weakly stated condemnation. Remember, only assholes assume.
glad you're more concerned about 'species politics' than gender politics. Who's the sociopath?
Riiiight, leftists and progressives... because it's not like PETA is entirely comprised of leftists and progressives or anything...
You're saying that Amy is biased about gender politics, so she should also be biased about animal rights. OK, I guess?
Go back and listen to it. She suggests those who oppose bullfights just don't get the beautiful "tradition" and "ritual," and what they really need to do is experience the abuse in person.
Assumably, tradition and ritual aren't acceptable justifications to Amy for sexist practices. It's only when animals are involved that leftists and progressives feel comfortable blathering that kind of nonsense.
Came here to post the exact opposite sentiment.
The fact that you even use the words "species politics" is so far outside any relevance to the cultures in question, it's a joke. Now, I'll give you one thing here: Spanish bullfighting is out of step with the state of life in Spain. However, Central and South American bullfighting makes perfect sense in the context of hard-luck cartel continent where life itself is a bit more of a commodity. It makes sense for a culture like that to stay in touch with the nature of death (we're talking about places with Santa Muerte shrines for chrissakes), and projecting our morals onto those places without also recognizing the luxuries they lack is so naive.
Also, if you're vegan, I can't say we see eye to eye but I certainly give you the credit of not being a hypocrite. But if not (and for everyone else)... Have you ever celebrated how delicious a steak is? Because in that situation, you're engaging in that hedonistic celebration of death WITHOUT even giving the animal the respect of recognizing its sacrifice.
As for the whole "tamale vendor" aspect, yeah, the mundanity is jarring, but all the more insight into the place that recognition of death has in day to day life compared to here.
She said it was tragic and that she wouldn't want to experience it again, but that there was some type of morbidly fascinating aspect to it in regards to its place in the culture... What's so sociopathic about that?
I did kind of chuckle when she commented on the sad/mournful aspect but added "then you sit through 5" corridas. The tamale vendor also adds an air of dignity to the proceedings, right Amy? I feel like Amy really missed her era, like British colonial india seems like it would have really been her jam as far as exoticizing foreign cultures.
What did you find sociopathic about it?